• Skip to primary navigation
  • Skip to main content
  • Skip to primary sidebar
  • Skip to footer
  • Home
  • About Strata-gee
  • Contact Us
  • Free Newsletter
  • Sponsor Strata-gee
  • Privacy Policy
  • Latest Posts
  • Strategy
  • Technology
  • Products
  • People
  • Statistics
  • Financial
  • Legal
  • Economic Data
  • Shows & Events

Strata-gee.com

Strategy in TECH...

Crestron Infra-Bass
You are here: Home / Law / Snap One Lawsuit: AVA & Josh.ai File Responses; The Dance Marathon Begins

Snap One Lawsuit: AVA & Josh.ai File Responses; The Dance Marathon Begins

October 25, 2023 by Ted Leave a Comment

The Snap One lawsuit will be long, like a dance marathon

After receiving an extension from the court giving them more time to respond, AVA, Inc. and Josh.ai, Inc. formally filed their responses to the Snap One, LLC lawsuit filed against them this past summer. With these filings, we have completed the end of the beginning of what will undoubtedly be a long dance marathon of patent and trade secret litigation.

See more on the AVA and Josh.ai responses to allegations from Snap One

I first told you about the surprising lawsuit filed by Snap One in this August post. That initial filing contained allegations of some pretty shocking actions by two companies that are well respected in the custom integration community. Not only did Snap One circulate the news of their lawsuit filing, but they also made two of their executives available to speak with the media at length about the matter.

Of course, I learned long ago that allegations are just allegations and there are always two sides to every story. Or I guess in this instance, three sides – as both the original lawsuit and these responses pretty clearly delineate that the allegations and assertions are specific to the individual parties.

AudioControl Single Zone Amps

A Pretty Perfunctory Process

So responding to any lawsuit is a pretty perfunctory process. Basically, your goal is NOT to try and win your case at this early stage. Rather, you simply want to indicate those allegations that you admit are true…or those that you deny as false.

Generally, those that you willingly admit to are along the lines of this statement from AVA: “AVA admits that it is a Delaware corporation with a place of business in Park City, Utah.” On the other hand, denials can be brief, such as this one from Josh.ai: “Josh.ai denies the allegations of paragraph 8.”

A 153 Page Lawsuit with 73 Pages of Allegations

There are some variations on a theme, but court rules require that all allegations be addressed by each of the defendants. Considering that Snap One’s original complaint contained 73 pages of allegations (and was 153 pages long with exhibits), this makes the responses quite long as well. AVA’s response spanned 40-some pages, while Josh.ai’s was 34 pages long.

One thing that makes this case a little confusing is that some of Snap One’s many allegations seem targeted to apply to one defendant or the other, while others seem to apply to both. So there were a lot of crossover responses from the two defendants.

Sonance James Small Aperture
Snap One, AVA, and Josh websites

Admitting/Denying Allegations and Asserting Affirmative Defenses

In addition to responding to the allegations, defendants are allowed to assert what are known as affirmative defenses. An affirmative defense is a claimed defense that if found true would minimize or negate the plaintiff’s claims, even if the defendant were to lose the case. Many a case has been won on an affirmative defense.

AVA asserted a total of twenty-three affirmative defenses. Many of these were specifically related to Snap One’s patent and trade dress claims. Others were commonly used affirmative defenses such as estoppel, laches, and unclean hands.

A Couple of AVA Affirmative Defenses Caught My Attention

But two of AVA’s affirmative defenses caught my attention.

As seen above, this “Eighteenth Defense” asserts that AVA had “implicit permission to use the Asserted Patents.” This suggests that there was an implied, but not expressed, permission for AVA to use the patents. However, in August, AVA founder Raphael Oberholzer said in response to Snap One’s original filing, “In fact, we even disclosed our plans for AVA to Snap One before going live and got their approval in writing.”

So if Oberholzer was being completely truthful, then AVA had explicit permission to proceed.

AVA logo

AVA: Snap One is Exhibiting ‘Bad Faith’

In its twenty-third affirmative defense, AVA alleged that Snap One brought this litigation in bad faith. This is something that sources from both defendants angrily told me at the time.

AVA then counter-sued Snap One, alleging four counts related to the patents it had asserted in its original complaint. In Count One, AVA asks the court for a judgment of non-infringement of the ‘623 patent. Count Two asserts that the ‘623 patent is invalid for failing to satisfy select sections of the Patent Act and asks the judge to declare it so. Count Three asks the court for a judgment of non-infringement of the ‘137 patent. And finally, Count Four asserts that the ‘137 patent is invalid for failing to satisfy key sections of the patent act and asks the judge to declare it so.

Finally, AVA joined with Snap One in requesting a trial by jury.

Josh logo

Similarities and Differences in the Josh.ai Filing

While there were many similarities between how AVA responded and how Josh.ai responded to the allegations in the Snap One lawsuit, in many instances, Josh’s response had more nuance and entered new arguable facts into the discussion. For example, look at the top image below of Paragraph 59 of the Snap One suit. Here Snap One notes they have an exclusive agreement that “obligated Josh.ai to refer all Control4 Dealers” to purchase products through Snap One. This explanation is setting up a claim made later in the document that Josh.ai violated that agreement.

Now look at the excerpt from the Josh.ai response to Paragraph 59 shown in the image below. Notice the small but – for Josh.ai anyway – important added text underlined in red [added by me]. It appears to be directly quoting from the distribution agreement.

Josh.ai Response to Paragraph 59 Notes Key Text from Distribution Agreement

You can see that Josh.ai added in language describing the important fact that the distribution agreement with Snap One apparently allowed Josh.ai to sell their products to any dealer that they have a “direct purchasing relationship” with. This is likely a marker for a potential argument asserting that Josh.ai did not violate the Snap One distribution agreement.

Josh.ai Denies Providing ‘Unauthorized Access’ in Response to Paragraph 103

Another interesting response, was their denial of the allegation in Paragraph 103. See it below…

Again, Josh.ai entered an argument as part of its response – in this case, denying the original allegation. All they needed to do was a simple denial, but they signal here that they are prepared to fight each allegation.

There are more examples of this kind of response by Josh.ai. But you get the idea.

Snap One and AVA remotes
At the heart of the Snap One lawsuit are these remote controls. Snap One says AVA stole its patents and ‘trade dress’ or look and feel. Do these four remotes look identical to you? [Click to enlarge]

Josh.ai Affirmative Defenses

Like AVA, Josh.ai also asserted affirmative defenses. However, while AVA asserted twenty-three affirmative defenses, Josh.ai…like a boss…asserted no fewer than forty-one affirmative defenses. And just as I did with AVA, I found a few of the Josh.ai defenses interesting.

Much like AVA, many of the Josh.ai affirmative defenses are of your standard issue, garden variety type – laches, estoppel, unclean hands, etc. Also, like their co-defendant, Josh.ai took aim at the patents asserted by Snap One – saying they did not infringe on any of the claimed patents. And these patents, Josh.ai argues, are invalid anyway…so the court should declare them so.

Calls Out Snap One ‘Bad Faith’ After Showing ‘Exculpatory Evidence’

One of the affirmative defenses that caught my eye was the second defense, titled Bad Faith Claim of Misappropriation. Josh.ai asserts in this affirmative defense that Snap One “had no evidence of misappropriation prior to commencing this lawsuit…” Then they add more…

I particularly found the last line to be interesting. Josh.ai claims here that “even after having been confronted with exculpatory evidence,” Snap One “continues to maintain this suit.” If they can prove this to the judge’s satisfaction, Snap One may very well be deemed to be acting in “bad faith.” Judges don’t like that…

Snap One logo

Josh.ai Says Don’t Blame Us

My final favorite section of the Josh.ai affirmative defenses is its eighteenth defense, where Josh.ai maintains that Snap One “suffered no recoverable damages attributable to Josh.ai’s conduct.” I can’t say for sure, but this appears to be a reference to Josh.ai’s co-defendant, AVA.

It is clear to me that the prime motivator for this lawsuit was the allegations that AVA had misappropriated Snap One patents and remote designs to create their own version of Snap’s “NEEO” remote in competition with Snap One. Adding insult to injury (in Snap One’s mind anyway), AVA went on to partner with Josh.ai to offer them a Josh-branded version of the AVA Remote (the Josh Remote) with all the same or similar design and technology advantages. It was not long after that this suit was filed.

We’re ‘Not Liable for the Acts of Others’

Josh.ai is saying, in effect, hold on a minute…AVA offered their remote to us with our brand on it to benefit our customers. So to Josh.ai’s way of thinking, we didn’t damage Snap One’s business and so you can’t hold us accountable for the actions of others…nodding in the direction of AVA.

Finally, like Snap One and AVA, Josh.ai demands a trial by jury. So at least there’s one thing they all agree upon.

Josh remotes by AVA, a key element of the Snap One lawsuit
Here is the new Josh Remote which is made by AVA [Click to enlarge]

Up Next: Discovery

There is a long way to go in this matter, but these defendant filings in response to the initial complaint really mark the end of the beginning. Up next is a long period of discovery where all parties get to demand many things from each other, including documents, issue interrogatories (specific questions for which the other party must provide written answers), and conduct depositions of key executives of each party.

There will also be a series of hearings to discuss various motions by the parties, many connected with the discovery process. While the trial is a ways off, there will be much activity by the attorneys up to that point.

For More Information

There are more details on this lawsuit, including a full listing of the claims asserted by Snap One, in my post of August 18, 2023, which you can see by following this link…

Learn more about Snap One at snapone.com.

See all the latest on Josh.ai at josh.ai…and AVA at ava.com.

Share this post:

  • Tweet
  • Click to share on Reddit (Opens in new window) Reddit
  • More
  • Click to email a link to a friend (Opens in new window) Email
  • Click to print (Opens in new window) Print

Like this:

Like Loading...

Related

Filed Under: Law, Management, Manufacturers, News Tagged With: AVA, Josh.ai, patent infringement, Snap One

Reader Interactions

Leave a Reply Cancel reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *


The reCAPTCHA verification period has expired. Please reload the page.

This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Learn how your comment data is processed.

Primary Sidebar

Search

Sign-Up for Our FREE Newsletter

loader

Latest Posts

T-Day+1: Tariffs…And So It Begins…

**NEW Update 6/13/25** - See a Selection of Tariff Programs from Around the … [Read More...] about T-Day+1: Tariffs…And So It Begins…

Multiple Executive Changes Announced by Masimo; COO Muhsin to Resign July 1

In a new Form-8K filing with the Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC) on … [Read More...] about Multiple Executive Changes Announced by Masimo; COO Muhsin to Resign July 1

  • T-Day+1: Tariffs…And So It Begins…
  • A Dramatic Finale: Judge Orders Lutron to Pay GeigTech *Double Damages,* Interest & Costs
  • I’ve Gone Fishing…
  • In Its Boldest Move Yet, AVPro Global Acquires Control Solutions Maker RTI

Categories

Sponsors

Crestron Infra-Bass
AudioControl Single Zone Amps
Sonance James Small Aperture
Savant
Oasys Residential Technology Group

Tag Cloud

acquisition Amazon Apple AudioControl B&W Bowers & Wilkins CEDIA CEDIA Expo CES Control4 Core Brands COVID-19 Crestron D&M Holdings Denon Emerald Expositions Foxconn Gibson Brands Gibson Guitar Google Henry Juszkiewicz Hon Hai Precision Industry Co. housing starts Integra Joe Kiani LG Marantz Masimo Nortek OLED Onkyo Panasonic patent infringement Pioneer Samsung Savant Sharp smart home SnapAV Snap One Sonos Sony Sound United SpeakerCraft Toshiba

Footer

Got News?

HEY PR & Marketing Pros: Have NEWS for Strata-gee readers?

Send it to: HotNews@strata-gee.com

Meta

  • Log in
  • Entries feed
  • Comments feed
  • WordPress.org

Sponsor Strata-gee

Strata-gee Ads

Archives

Translate

Ted Green Bio

A former dealer, manufacturer, distributor & more. Focusing on business strategy, my goal is to help you make better decisions for greater success.

Follow Ted Green

  • Facebook
  • X
  • LinkedIn
  • Instagram

Copyright © 2025 Strata-gee.com · The Stratecon Group, Inc. All Rights Reserved · Log in

%d